Is schengen dead?

Discussion in 'Politics Discussion' started by Hedonologist, Nov 19, 2015.

  1. Hedonologist

    Hedonologist Well-Known Member

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    I'd say it's a foregone conclusion.

    Barriers and checks are being erected everywhere, and the situation looks like it will continue for a very long time. In practise it's already been suspended. I presure that soon enough the area will officially come to a close.

    What do you think?
     
  2. Susimi

    Susimi Senior Investor

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    This migrant crisis is really testing that system and it is starting to buckle, break and I cannot really see any other outcome to it.

    With so many people coming into the countries there do need to be checks in place and a lot of the countries the migrants are going through do not want them there so that's the reason for the erection of border fences now.

    The system might have worked years ago and it might have sounded good on paper, but I don't think the system expected this to happen at all.
     
  3. Alex

    Alex Senior Investor

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    I always thought the idea was stupid and was bound to fail, just like the EU. It's a shame people had to die to prove to the politicians theory doesn't work. Those in the EU will still sing how positive it is, but those voices will be drowned by the tears and those who have suffered.

    When issues center around France and Germany no one says anything, but when Hungary closed off it's borders they were criticized when migrants created a security risk to their border. It's a case of if France and Germany doing what they please.
     
  4. crimsonghost747

    crimsonghost747 Senior Investor

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    Schengen is a beautiful idea... I still think it is. The problem is: a single country at the edge of the schengen area that doesn't take good care of it's external borders will pretty much endanger the borders of the whole area. And with the intake of these so called refugees the external borders of the schengen area have been breached in countless different locations. A lot of us saw it coming but obviously nothing was done before it was too late.

    So yes, I would love my country to bring back full border control starting today. Not as a permanent solution but more along the lines of "we are bringing back full border checks which will continue for an undefined amount of time"
     
  5. Rainman

    Rainman Senior Investor

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    Conspiracy theorists [this isn't my opinion] claim that the French government and a number of other intelligence agencies knew of the imminent terror attacks but took no action because among other things this would solve EU's immigration problems [keep the refugees out] and also allow NATO to deploy troops to Syria. Either way the Paris attacks have come close to killing schengen. But there's also this development:

    http://www.politico.eu/article/nati...-********s-travel-freedom-migration-refugees/
    Radical changes to the EU’s Schengen area have been floated less than a week after the terror attacks in Paris raised questions about the future of the border-free zone.

    Five EU members — Germany, Austria, Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg — talked about creating a “mini-Schengen,” the Dutch newspaper De Volkskrant reported. It would be a dramatically scaled-down version of the ********-free zone, which currently has 26 members.
     
  6. Alex

    Alex Senior Investor

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    I find that EU politicians are so wrapped up in believing in their policies they forget the realities. They need to be seen to let these things like Schengen appear to work, and they don't. People can still cross borders, it doesn't stop them, they just have to show their ID or ********. It never stopped people, but made themselves vulnerable (more) and now they are paying the price for EU arrogance.

    Even having border controls doesn't stop terrorism, but it makes it harder for them to enter and provides a small safety net where people can be vetted. They may have known and had intelligence on attacks, but the human rights laws prevent them taking action until there is just cause or evidence. That means they have to have tip offs, get search warrants, or wait until something happens. By then deaths have occurred.
     
  7. 111kg

    111kg Guest

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    It's not dead and won't be dead too soon in my opinion. It's perfectly normal to go through some changes, mainly to prevent other attacks being made. The trouble is that the European Union, especially the countries from the Western Europe, chose to close their eyes to some problems. Yes, most of the social wellfare abusers are not Bulgarian, nor Romanian, nor rroma, but migrants from outside the EU. They are the ones that demand the same rights and priviliges, but refuse to adapt to the laws of the EU/Shengen space.

    This is why we need to throw out the politically correctness to garbage, where it rightfully belongs and do whatever it takes to prevent any act of terrorism from happening again, even if it's not right for certain groups of people.
     
  8. evelin

    evelin Well-Known Member

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    I believe that the problem that still persists within the EU mentality, is the obsolete concept by which it's gone till now, that of "accepting everyone as is, creating a diverse community". Now I don't mean to sound in any way racist or xenophobe towards anyone or anything, but I believe that we lack a more "restrictive" mentality in what concerns accepting absolutely anybody. Stiff isn't a good thing, but neither is overly-permissive. Balance in everything.
     
  9. Alex

    Alex Senior Investor

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    The reality is that the countries joined together for trade agreements, and also to support one another in times of war. Then power got to the politicians and the idea of a united 'one' community was only agreed as long as countries could opt out of things. Otherwise it would never have been passed.

    The fact is France has to declare a state of emergency to close its borders, which no one could blame them for, however with double standards, would it have been tolerated if it was not one of the big EU countries?
     
  10. crimsonghost747

    crimsonghost747 Senior Investor

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    Some of the smaller countries, was it hungary and maybe slovakia or something, started to close their borders in order to keep the refugee BS from ruining their countries. Of course this wasn't "accepted" by the other countries but it's like always "hey you shouldn't do that" and that's it.
    It's always like this, the shit needs to hit the fan BEFORE something is done, whereas common sense would lead us to do something to prevent the shit from hitting the fan.
     

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