Free Education For Everyone, so says Hillary. You betcha.

Discussion in 'Politics Discussion' started by baudwalk, Aug 14, 2015.

  1. My401K

    My401K Well-Known Member

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    Education on the face is a great idea, what is a bad idea is funding advanced education for useless pursuits. plain and simple not everyone that goes to college is going to be a nuclear scientist of a doctor, sadly many students drop out or leave with Liberal Arts degrees in useless study. I know of a young woman whose parents spent their hard earned money to send her to a good college and she chose Japanese Cultural Studies. On her actual internship to Japan she spent her time buying and focusing on Anime, actually making no serious business connections that would do her any good. Now she works at Delta Sonic and chances of her ever being able to use that degree is very slim. Likewise a young man I know got a degree in Film Media and although on path to some serious media related journalism chose instead to do nothing with the degree. Last I heard he was working at Wegmans as a stock boy.

    In the past higher education was meant for those that were bright and those that had certain social class. I think by opening schools to everyone we are simply diluting the value of a degree. I have noticed that many of the more in demand career tracks need far more then just four years study, and quite frankly that's how it should be. Sadly Community College is just a longer version of High School that at best serves as a sort of training for semi skilled labor. It seldom reaches the point of serious academic pursuit. If anyone should pay to make education available to the masses it should be corporate America since they are the ones hiring these lower skilled workers.
     
  2. ScooterBrandon

    ScooterBrandon Senior Investor

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    As mentioned, there are LOTS of options for funding an education. Why should taxpayers foot the bill, when if you are ambitious enough then you can find the money for an education.
    Although, devils advocate might say that the majority of education is already publicly paid for, so why not just have the state pay for the whole thing? There is nothing wrong with an educated population.
     
  3. 111kg

    111kg Guest

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    In my country, medical school is pretty much free as long as you are in the top 50% or even lower. For instance, at the medical school I want to attend, there are about 300 spots that get free education and about 15 spots for people that have to pay the annual fee of about $2000. However, the diploma is not recognized in US, but it's recognized in the rest of the world.
     
  4. JR Ewing

    JR Ewing Super Moderator Staff Member

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    There are already numerous need-based grants, scholarships, loans, work-study programs, etc. Plus there's the GI Bill/National Guard, etc.

    If "free college tuition for all" or something very similar somehow is pushed through, you're going to see the cost of education get even higher, taxes increase far more, the national debt skyrocket even higher, etc.

    And what about the many people out there who are simply not cut out for college who don't make it and who we end up wasting large amounts of tax dollars on? I guess next they'll be giving out degrees to everyone, regardless of their aptitude and ability to earn the degree?
     
  5. SteakTartare

    SteakTartare Senior Investor

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    I'm really getting sick of the "free" this and "free" that talk from some of the political class. These kinds of things aren't free because someone has to pickup the tab at some point. And the ones paying this bill are the roughly half of the adults that are paying all the taxes. It hardly free to have the government take one citizen money with the threat of fines, imprisonment, or violence.
     
  6. Jason76

    Jason76 Well-Known Member

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    I think college education should be free for some majors. However, some degrees don't provide enough jobs. Therefore, it's uncertain that society will get paid back. At the very least, a person who wants, for instance, a philosophy degree, should be required to do a double major with a more job friendly major.

    Of course, you should be able to substitute the useful part of the double major with training in some useful vocational trade, or a minor in some job friendly area of study.
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2015
  7. JR Ewing

    JR Ewing Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Expanding the govt role in our lives (and of course making at least some of us pay for that expansion) for more non-essential "free stuff" for some is never a good idea.
     
  8. Alex

    Alex Senior Investor

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    I do believe education should be available to those who would benefit and qualify as many that can afford to go aren't necessarily that clever. It should still be based on ability and then the colleges should have grants to those who cannot afford it. I have a friend from a well off foreign family and she gets C- and even Ds and she is now in UCLA because her dad can afford it. There are many people who are afraid to get into debt and are denied an education, now if they don't have good grades then no they shouldn't get free education or a grant.

    Often people are put off applying because it is a huge minefield, and removing that will help those who wish to study to apply. The army and military are a way to get tuition paid for in the UK too, and also that's why many students take on TA roles in exchange for credits. There are ways to get education paid, but each state varies and that's one of the issues as the fees vary and they shouldn't be that much of a difference if you are out of state.
     
  9. pwarbi

    pwarbi Senior Investor

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    As another person as said, in principle I agree that things like education and healthcare are basic rights and they shouldn't only be available to those that can afford it, but calling them free, is right.

    Somebody will have to pay, and that will be the taxpayer so would you be prepared to pay more tax, you have less money in your pocket so others can get a service without them paying into it? No, I thought not...
     
  10. petesede

    petesede Guest

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    And that was the same argument they were using in the 1890´s and early 1900s when people were pushing for public education up til HS for everyone. The USA largely became the most powerful country on the planet a generation after free HS education was provided. Free HS education is primarily what resulted in the USA having a middle class, who because of education, had the disposable income to drive our economy to where it is today.... more than twice the size of the nearest rival. Before 1900, the USA economy mainly was owners and serfs, with very little chance for either group to end up in the other group.

    You only need to look at history, either US history from a century ago, or just look at the data from states like GA that already have this type of program. Georgia, especially the Atlanta and Augusta areas, are thriving mainly thanks to a higher educated population than states like SC, Mississippi and Alabama.

    For me, this is a social issue where I think education is something we should be providing... but also it is just good economics as you can see by the turn the USA made when we added HS education as a requirement, but also by states where college is provided based on merit. The economic benefits greatly outweigh the costs. Education is an investment that has already been shown to pay off.
     

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